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Water flame - how would you do it?
show user profile  Dejitarujin
A Google search for: water flame reveals primarily four examples of, well, water as fire, or however you want to say it. I can't find any information on where they came from, but people have mostly had luck reproducing it with Photoshop.

I want to use it as an effect; a fully 3D, animated effect. But I haven't the foggiest idea where I'd begin. Obviously with some fluid simulator, but...well come on, that's not normal liquid behavior! :P

So, how would you create such an effect?
~~~
Specialty: Non-organic modelling and effects.
Setup: 3D Studio 2010 with finalRender.
Rig: No, no I can't.
read 1324 times
1/28/2009 4:58:47 AM (last edit: 1/28/2009 4:58:47 AM)
show user profile  killerbee2
it's quite easy, you simulate water with realflow or alike and you give the mesh a water shading...
In realflow you can use different daemons to achieve the desired flame effect.

Water and fire are quite simular towards simulation. Only difference is water is affected by gravity, fire by airturbulence.


You could prolly pull this off more easily with pflow and blobmesh.
Follow allan mckays tutorial on smoke and use it with blobmesh.




read 1316 times
1/28/2009 5:01:00 AM (last edit: 1/28/2009 5:59:19 AM)
show user profile  Dub.
hehe

A test I did a year or so ago.
http://www.filamentvfx.co.nz/dump/candle_test_02.mov

I used fumeFX, Pflow and a blobmesh


read 1237 times
1/28/2009 12:02:43 PM (last edit: 1/28/2009 12:04:03 PM)
show user profile  Stianbl
Wow, thats a nice example dub! =D

I think this effect looks awesome! I want to learn this too.. ;)

btw: heres a pic from google, to illustrate it in this thread:


read 1226 times
1/28/2009 12:15:00 PM (last edit: 1/28/2009 12:15:00 PM)
show user profile  BishBashRoss2
very cool.





read 1225 times
1/28/2009 12:15:08 PM (last edit: 1/28/2009 12:15:08 PM)
show user profile  parkerfamily
funky vertex weighting and udside down gravity?
read 1169 times
1/28/2009 4:55:53 PM (last edit: 1/28/2009 4:55:53 PM)
show user profile  Dejitarujin
Wow, why didn't I think of using FumeFX? It makes actual flame shapes!

I may even be able to take it a step further, with Glu3D/PWrapper instead of just blobmesh.

Realflow might be the ultimate solution. But it may be overkill. Still, good option for those who have it and know how to use it.

Thanks a lot! This is fantastic. Time to get to work...
~~~
Specialty: Non-organic modelling and effects.
Setup: 3D Studio 2010 with finalRender.
Rig: No, no I can't.
read 1152 times
1/28/2009 6:12:20 PM (last edit: 1/28/2009 6:12:20 PM)
show user profile  Dub.
I used BoomerLabs SuperBlob (currently in beta) for the blobmesh.

You could use pWrapper or just the standard max one as well. (just not as fast)

It would be really hard to get a nice flame shape in realflow it would tend to just explode.


read 1142 times
1/28/2009 6:16:47 PM (last edit: 1/28/2009 6:21:34 PM)
show user profile  Dejitarujin
Hmm, interesting. Trying to actually create this at the right scale isn't working so well, I can't even get past the FumeFX setup. Just kinda burns unlike anything I've ever seen before; manipulating settings will get me either a pillar or an afro of flame, but nothing at all with a tear-drop shape. Anyone got the values for a to-scale match flame?
~~~
Specialty: Non-organic modelling and effects.
Setup: 3D Studio 2010 with finalRender.
Rig: No, no I can't.
read 1089 times
1/30/2009 2:02:41 AM (last edit: 1/30/2009 2:02:41 AM)
show user profile  Dub.
Go through the manual and tuts for fume, I recall I had to use a few non-default settings, but it didn't take long to get something candle-like - I've done much more realistic candles before, so it's not hard.


read 1078 times
1/30/2009 2:52:09 AM (last edit: 1/30/2009 2:52:09 AM)
show user profile  Henrik Jonsson
Very nice work Dub!

What renderer did you use, and is it a HDRI map that facilitates the creation of the spectral colors in the falloff?
read 1059 times
1/30/2009 4:32:29 AM (last edit: 1/30/2009 4:32:29 AM)
show user profile  Dub.
It's rendered with Brazil.

It's just a test with low settings, thus a little grainy in places.


read 1005 times
1/31/2009 1:40:33 PM (last edit: 1/31/2009 1:40:33 PM)
show user profile  amckay
yeah fume will create great motion but you wont be able to get refraction from it
have you tried real flow? you can put in the properties for fire to get realistic looking flame motion, and that will output a shape.

Otherwise what I would do is use fume but output the vector channel and generate particles from that and then use those particles to generate a metaparticle mesh. That will be refractive.

-Allan McKay
Allan McKay

Autodesk Master 2007
New Fume FX: Advanced! Fluids Training DVD http://www.allanmckay.com/FFXDVD2.html

read 910 times
3/12/2009 4:28:20 AM (last edit: 3/12/2009 4:31:41 AM)
show user profile  Dr. Jim
Not gonna argue with that......
read 897 times
3/12/2009 4:57:51 AM (last edit: 3/12/2009 4:57:51 AM)
show user profile  Dejitarujin
Oh holy hell, is that really Allan McKay? >.>

In the end, FumeFX is what I used, along with a demo of Glu3D. The thing is, neither fire nor water actually act like what the images show :P They're definitely either photomanips or convoluted particle tricks. However, I did get something similar to what Dub linked to up there. As a still frame, it just looks like an amorphous blob (as it lacks the exaggerated features making the original images obvious), but in an animation it looks quite acceptable.

I haven't messed with RealFlow much myself - looks complicated ;) But I might give it another go.
~~~
Specialty: Non-organic modelling and effects.
Setup: 3D Studio 2010 with finalRender.
Rig: No, no I can't.
read 888 times
3/12/2009 5:31:39 AM (last edit: 3/12/2009 5:31:39 AM)
 
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