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Move two areas of a single mesh in symmetry?
show user profile  avionz

As above really. I've got a character model that I want to slightly edit by straightening out the arms. My mesh is a single object now so I can't use the symmetry modifier any more. Is there any way I can select both arms and have them move in symmetry? I just want the model to be looking the same on both sides.

The way I'm moving them now is by adding a new editable poly modifier to the stack, selecting the appropriate polygons then moving them.

Any advice appreciated. Thanks :)
read 599 times
4/18/2008 3:32:31 AM (last edit: 4/18/2008 3:32:31 AM)
show user profile  mrgrotey
You want both sides looking the same but you cant add a symmetry modifier? why not?

If you want the arms the same but the torso/head is puposely no longer symmetrical, then try selecting the arm faces, detaching them, add a symmetry modifier to the arm object, adjust the mesh, then re attach the arms to the body again?

read 596 times
4/18/2008 3:35:03 AM (last edit: 4/18/2008 3:35:24 AM)
show user profile  avionz
Sorry, my knowledge in 3dsmax is still at an early stage (and will be for a lonnng time). I will try it now :)

I assume I should delete the 'original' arm faces after they are detached?
read 592 times
4/18/2008 3:42:50 AM (last edit: 4/18/2008 3:42:50 AM)
show user profile  mrgrotey
Well as long as you dont tick the 'clone' box in the detach dialogue then they will be removed anyway

read 590 times
4/18/2008 3:43:48 AM (last edit: 4/18/2008 3:43:48 AM)
show user profile  avionz
I tried the symmetry modifier but it does not mirror the arms new position even when the options are changed. The orange lines change to a diagonal position which is not normal I think. Having said that, if I leave the arm in its original position the new arm mirrors fine (after changing options)

Then I tried 'mirroring' it instead which worked fine up until the point where both arms are attached to the mesh and one arm is welded. The second arm only welds some vertices for some reason. Upping the threshold does not seem to work either.

Any ideas?

read 578 times
4/18/2008 4:32:14 AM (last edit: 4/18/2008 4:34:11 AM)
show user profile  mrgrotey
Can you post some images of your problem, its not coming over clear enough (to me at least) to give you proper advice. If you dont know how to post images check


read 567 times
4/18/2008 4:40:55 AM (last edit: 4/18/2008 4:40:55 AM)
show user profile  avionz
No problem. This is what it looks like once I have:

Deleted one arm
Detached one arm
Applied symmetry modifier (changed some settings - x,y,z etc)

At this stage the arm and new symmetrical arm is in the 'old' position (before detachment).

This is what it looks like when I:

Delete the symmetry modifier
Rotate the right arm (top one in next image) to new position
Apply new symmetry modifier (changed some settings x,y,z etc)

Note how the orange lines are 'diagonal' now. I think the problem is with them!

This is when I try using the 'mirror tool' instead. One arm welds perfectly fine, but some vertices of the other arm do not even though it is attached to the body.


read 563 times
4/18/2008 5:00:00 AM (last edit: 4/18/2008 5:10:40 PM)
show user profile  mrgrotey
Right the problem with the diagonal orange line (the symmetry plane) is that it aligns itseslf to the pivot point of the onject you add it to, and as you have rotated the arm up before adding the modifier, the pivot point is also rotated with it.

What you need to do is:

- Detach you arm

- Rotate it into desired position

- select the arm mesh
- Go to the heirarchy panel

- click the 'Affect Pivot Only' button
- Click the align button on the main toolbar

- click the body mesh and tick all position and orientation boxes (this will align the arm's pivot point to match the body's pivot point)

- click the 'Affect Pivot Only' button again the deactivate it

- Add the symmetry modifier to the arm and it will be upright as it should be

- attach the arms to the body and weld

- if then it doesnt line up to your body mesh then its the body that isnt symetrical also, if so you will need to target weld the body verts to the arm verts

read 558 times
4/18/2008 5:17:01 AM (last edit: 4/18/2008 5:18:48 AM)
show user profile  avionz
Thanks for the informative reply Mr Grotey. Unfortunately when I apply the symmetry modifier it still does not line up as it should. Hmmmz.

Do you have any idea as to why some vertices do not weld? (third image).

I'm only trying to straighten the arms out as when I apply a biped/physique to the mesh, followed by a BIP file, the biceps seem to bulk up some what :/ - I don't even know if straightening them would fix that hehe.

read 547 times
4/18/2008 5:35:04 AM (last edit: 4/18/2008 5:35:04 AM)
show user profile  mrgrotey
Well I can see any reason why the method I gave wouldnt work, with all due respect I think you just did it wrong, have a nother go, this is the way to do it. And to answer your question read the last line in my last reply

[edit] actually Im presuming that the pivot point for the body mesh is on the centre-line, is it? because it needs to be for my method to work

read 540 times
4/18/2008 5:39:58 AM (last edit: 4/18/2008 5:42:26 AM)
show user profile  avionz
Sorry for the late reply.

I will try it again, no problem :). The pivot of the actual mesh is in between the two feet. I think a screenie will describe it better:

By centre line, do you mean near the pelvis area?

Cheers for the help so far!
read 523 times
4/18/2008 9:12:27 AM (last edit: 4/18/2008 5:10:48 PM)
show user profile  mrgrotey
No thats fine that pivot IS on the center line, therefore I dont see any reason why the method I said shouldnt work if followed correctly

read 518 times
4/18/2008 9:22:50 AM (last edit: 4/18/2008 9:22:50 AM)
show user profile  avionz
Ok, thanks. I'm gonna try this again now..hopefully it works.

One thing, when I do detach, I detach it in the polygon sub-object mode. Also, I delete one half of the arm. Nothing wrong in doing that is there? Just making sure!
read 513 times
4/18/2008 9:29:30 AM (last edit: 4/18/2008 9:29:30 AM)
show user profile  mrgrotey
Nope sounds good to me, technically you dont actually need to delete one half as the symmettry modifier gets rid of the other side when the first side gets mirrored over, but deleting it yourself will get rid of any confusion.

read 506 times
4/18/2008 9:41:23 AM (last edit: 4/18/2008 9:41:23 AM)
show user profile  avionz
This is what I did:

Add new editable poly modifier to stack
Selected polygon, deleted one half of the arm, and detached the other (with both checkboxes in the window unchecked)
Rotated the arm to desired position. It gives this after rotation only:

So I moved the arm to:

Then I selected the arm, went to hierarchical panel and pressed: Affect pivot only


Pressed align button, selected the body, and checked the following:

Which then moved the arms pivot to here:

Deactivated 'Affect pivot only'
Applied symmetry modifier to the arm

Gives the best result as this after changing the x,y,z,slice along mirror settings etc:

Have I done anything wrong? Thanks!

read 500 times
4/18/2008 10:01:51 AM (last edit: 4/18/2008 5:11:06 PM)
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