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Liquid simulation; need software recommendation!
show user profile  Stianbl
Hi guys,

So, we really need to start looking into liquid simulation where I work, and we've been playing around with RealFlow for now. What we've learned is that it's really slow to use, and I was wondering if there was any other softwares out there that would be able to do the work we need faster.

This is what we mainly need to simulate:
-foam and water splash around objects (i.e. a boat on the sea, waves hitting it and generates realistic foam/splash particles.)
-motion of water flowing around objects (i.e a boat on the sea, interacting with the waves and the flow.

Surely we can do this with realwaves, but simulation time for a 10sec sequence is about 3 days, which is way too much.

We want to look into Houdini, which I have never tried before.

Therefor I wanted to ask you guys, if you had any recommendations towards what software we should use to get the results we need. :)

Thanks a lot in advance,


read 737 times
2/8/2011 3:29:37 PM (last edit: 2/8/2011 3:29:37 PM)
show user profile  advance-software

read 716 times
2/8/2011 4:45:02 PM (last edit: 2/8/2011 4:45:02 PM)
show user profile  Nanne
As far as I know RealFlow is the best software for fluids, so if that is not fast enough you might be out of luck :P

Unless there are some cool GPU accelerated softwares out there that can to the job, like the one AS posted about.

Perhaps ParticeFlow with PhysX simulation with the Box#2 Pro plug-in from Orbaz can be of good help:
http://www.orbaz.com/products/particleflow/box2/

Intro Tutorial by Allan McKay:
http://vimeo.com/11128933


Kristoffer Helander
www.kristofferhelander.se
  :: Works ::   |  :: Resumé ::   |  :: Contact ::   |  :: CG Blog ::   |  :: Links ::     
read 710 times
2/8/2011 5:04:43 PM (last edit: 2/8/2011 5:04:58 PM)
show user profile  carrrottt09
Have you checked out Glu3D? It's been years since I used it, but I had pretty good results.
read 695 times
2/8/2011 9:02:44 PM (last edit: 2/8/2011 9:02:44 PM)
show user profile  Dub.
Naiad is pretty much the most advanced at the moment.

You'll need to know what you're doing and it's linux only atm.


read 670 times
2/9/2011 2:43:24 AM (last edit: 2/9/2011 2:43:24 AM)
show user profile  Bolteon
believe me... waiting 3 days to sim via realflow is a smudge compared to how long it'll take you to learn something new.


stick with what works this time and plan better next time.



//edit

and now, reading up on naiad... as impressive as it is... it still takes 7.3 hours for 5 seconds of animation.

so your 10 would come in at ~15 hours.

while that's a lot lower than the 72 hours you'd take to do it with realflow... you'd only be gaining 55 hours or so.

thats a little more than two days... and it'll take you more than 2 days to get associated with naiad or any other program for that matter.

though, this arguement falls to pieces in the case that you have 30 10 second shots of water sim needing to be done.


for further reading:
http://www.exoticmatter.com/movies/



//edit2

sweet baby jesus... a license is 7400 per year? yikes.

-Marko Mandaric



read 661 times
2/9/2011 3:58:00 AM (last edit: 2/9/2011 4:20:15 AM)
show user profile  Stianbl
Ey, thanks a lot for all the feedback :)
I'll go through what you've all said and have a look.

I really appreciate all the help :)


read 647 times
2/9/2011 7:41:59 AM (last edit: 2/9/2011 7:41:59 AM)
show user profile  killerbee2
Realflow isnt slow if you know how to use it.
Work in steps in your workflow and learn how densities versus scale works etc.

You can get pretty accurate previz results with fast low density solutions, once that's good, up all settings for final simulations.

3 days for a 10sec simulation is too slow. With decent hardware you could easily bring that down to less then a day.




read 642 times
2/9/2011 9:08:13 AM (last edit: 2/9/2011 9:08:13 AM)
show user profile  Nik Clark
jareu, I have deleted your post.

Please do not condone warez or illegal downloads here. It is not tolerated on this forum.





read 623 times
2/9/2011 12:26:31 PM (last edit: 2/9/2011 12:26:31 PM)
show user profile  Stianbl
@killerbee2:
This is what I really need. Do you know any resources (tutorials) that will teach me tips and tricks like this? Someone also told me that it's better to simulate a couple simulations with lower resolution than one big simulation, and this is just the kind of information I'd need.

I am doing some research myself too, but I just cant seem to find any real good explanations of the methods in an actual example.

What we need RealFlow to do is:
1. Simulate liquids flowing. Oil, water, and stuff like that. From pipes, for example. This is all good, Simulation here is fast and good, but I'd still want some more information on how to make it look more like water, or oil, for example. But the most important simulations is the second step here;

2. Right now I'm working on an object thats submerged in water (in the ocean). It's supposed to enter a hole in a boat, and we want it to look realistic when it breaks the surface of the ocean and rises. So, we need water to be lifted when it reaches the surface, and water coming off as it continues to rise (just like it would in real life).

The second part there should be easy enough to simulate, but I'm still in the learning process, and would need more specific information on how to do these kind of simulations efficient and with good quality.

I've got my workstation:
2x Intel Xeon E5540 (8 threads), 12GB RAM

And I've also got one of our render blades to deal with the simulations:
2x Intel Xeon X5650 (24 threads), 12GB RAM

Still, simulations are slow, and the reason for that is because I don't know the software good enough yet. I want to learn :) This is something we really need, and I'm eager to learn.

Any resources would be great, and I'll go through anything that comes up.

Thanks a lot in advance,


read 611 times
2/9/2011 1:25:09 PM (last edit: 2/9/2011 1:25:09 PM)
show user profile  jareu
haha rats, i just realized that sarcasm isnt very well conveyed through text. but my bad, wont do it again.



He who says it cannot be done is interrupting the man doing it.

read 600 times
2/9/2011 2:22:59 PM (last edit: 2/9/2011 2:22:59 PM)
show user profile  Nik Clark
Ah. No worries. There needs to be a sarcasm flag.



read 600 times
2/9/2011 2:24:39 PM (last edit: 2/9/2011 2:24:39 PM)
show user profile  Dr. Jim
I cannot offer any more than what has been said here,.....it about covers it.

Keep in mind though that there are "careers" for Fluid Sim artists,....the more "real" you want the more epic the learning curve and more epic the hardware requirements.
Realistic fluids is still pretty cutting edge stuff,....and if 'real' is your goal, then you are right up there with Hollywood in its pursuits.

So good luck!!
read 591 times
2/9/2011 3:03:40 PM (last edit: 2/9/2011 3:03:40 PM)
show user profile  Garp
Two years ago there was a tutorial - or rather a complete break down - of the water simulation for the last InterMedia logo. I've tried to find it again but it looks like it's gone.
Maybe someone else has a link (?).




read 583 times
2/9/2011 3:37:28 PM (last edit: 2/9/2011 3:50:54 PM)
show user profile  Dr. Jim
Hnmm.....if its the one I am thinking of.........its not that good is it? Pretty CG looking......
read 577 times
2/9/2011 4:06:53 PM (last edit: 2/9/2011 4:06:53 PM)
 
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