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Lighting tutorial without daylight
show user profile  Neomace
I'm struggling to find any tutorials to help me understand lighting a scene where there isn't any daylight, there will be a very small amount of night glow coming down a stairwell.

If someone knows of a tutorial video or otherwise I would be most grateful.
Feedback and Comments always appreciated.

Kind regards

read 737 times
10/6/2014 5:24:28 PM (last edit: 10/6/2014 5:24:28 PM)
show user profile  mike_renouf
Which Render engine?

read 711 times
10/6/2014 6:56:30 PM (last edit: 10/6/2014 6:56:30 PM)
show user profile  Neomace
Still getting to grips with everything


I'm using Mental Ray
Feedback and Comments always appreciated.

Kind regards

read 676 times
10/7/2014 4:17:50 PM (last edit: 10/7/2014 4:18:27 PM)
show user profile  mike_renouf
This will be challenging if you're new to max, but an excellent learning topic! Basically the sort of scene you're describing relies almost entirely on bounced light, so you'll need to get the most out of your Final Gather setup and you might also consider using photon mapping (which mental ray calls Global Illumination).

You'll need to set the mental ray photographic exposure levels to suit a low-light scene. I would then add a daylight system, set the location and time to suit, then edit the an mr sky map from the environment slot. If you've never used these tools before I'd look up some tutorials on YouTube to get a feel for them. Put a skyportal at the location of the light source in your scene, turn on final gather and do some tests. Hopefully that gives you a starting point?

read 669 times
10/7/2014 7:25:36 PM (last edit: 10/7/2014 7:25:36 PM)
show user profile  Neomace
Wow thanks Mike that's more than I expected to receive.

A lot of what your talking about makes sense. I've been watching tutorials for the past few days and playing with the different settings.

So thank you very much. I'll keep you updated.
Feedback and Comments always appreciated.

Kind regards

read 662 times
10/7/2014 10:40:39 PM (last edit: 10/7/2014 10:40:39 PM)
show user profile  ccampbell
Great answer Mike,

Here is a fantastic global illumination tutorial for novice. This is exactly the kind of lighting set up you are referring to neomace.

Good luck!

$Entrepreneur = if((Designer + Engineer)*Programmer){Problem Solver};

read 658 times
10/7/2014 11:15:19 PM (last edit: 10/7/2014 11:15:19 PM)
show user profile  Neomace
Fantastic thank your very much.

I'm halfway through the tutorial and I can now see how I can light the club.

Again thank you everyone for the guidance.
Feedback and Comments always appreciated.

Kind regards

read 651 times
10/8/2014 1:36:34 AM (last edit: 10/8/2014 10:52:31 AM)
show user profile  Neomace
Ok I've complete the tutorial and just want to see if I've got something right.

For the scene I want to have 2 different outcomes.
1st: A realistic representation of the structure and the setup of the club
2nd: A more atmospheric look with the club in use. With this I want to produce a video fly through while using populate as a sort of advertising video.

So my idea is, to start by creating the environment lights even though thy're not needed to light the club but this will be needed for the photometric lights coming down the entrance stairwell although this light would be hardly notice.

Now I'm going to go through some more tutorials today with regards to virtual lights for the simulation of the lighting system in the club. There is a but, do I use both Standard lights to create the effects from the internal lights and like I've said above for the photometric daylight system together to create the desired outcome. Obviously I'd need to change the environment light for sun during the structure and setup renders.

Am I lost? :P
Feedback and Comments always appreciated.

Kind regards

read 640 times
10/8/2014 3:24:11 PM (last edit: 10/8/2014 3:24:11 PM)
show user profile  Neomace
Just read this and a little panic set in.

'Unlike the outside, interior scenes typically have numerous lights, and a general ambient light level is not ideal for simulating the diffuse reflection of local light sources. For interiors, it’s common to set the scene’s environment ambient level to black, and use lights that effect ambient only to simulate the regional areas of diffuse reflection.'

This means my earlier questions are incorrect. I need to focus on standard lights and simulate the ambient lighting in the club.

(Internal voices making a racket in my head)
Feedback and Comments always appreciated.

Kind regards

read 637 times
10/8/2014 3:38:58 PM (last edit: 10/8/2014 3:38:58 PM)
show user profile  Nik Clark
Never use ambient light. Not ever.

read 634 times
10/8/2014 3:43:39 PM (last edit: 10/8/2014 3:43:39 PM)
show user profile  mike_renouf
Nick's right. From a technical standpoint never use the ambient light setting on the environment tab. This ambient light was for faking global illumination when not using a physically based lighting scheme. By using final gather and mental ray, you're pursuing a true-to-life lighting scheme.

Another important factor. When you say you're planning on using "standard" lights you should stay away from Max's standard lights. Use instead Photometric lights and/or mental ray lights. Standard lights do not illuminate the scene in a way you can synchronise with the photographic exposure controls and probably don't react with mental ray materials properly

Which brings me on to another point- materials:

Only use the mental ray arch&design material type. Never add pure black or pure white in the diffuse colour slot. Always use IOR falloff. In this way you'll simulate real world materials more accurately.

Hope this helps!

read 622 times
10/8/2014 10:11:11 PM (last edit: 10/8/2014 10:11:11 PM)
show user profile  Neomace
Many thanks Nik and Mike,

I did a lot of homework after reading your suggestions and understood that I'd got it completely wrong from the tutorials I've done. I'll be using Photometric and staying away from the Environment tab.
Feedback and Comments always appreciated.

Kind regards

read 605 times
10/9/2014 1:19:21 PM (last edit: 10/9/2014 1:19:21 PM)
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