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CPU / GPU Rendering
show user profile  Jock
I read some news on a forum today about Vray and a demo they gave which used GPU rendering as opposed to CPU.

In laymans terms what exactly will that result in, does it just mean that if you dont have a great cpu, or many cores you could use your gpu instead and get a faster render? And what if you have a decent say dual-quad core, will you still in cases like that use your cpu, or will you find the gpu version no doubt still faster?

I just dont really understand the difference other than one uses cpu and one uses gpu.
read 2193 times
8/10/2009 5:10:25 AM (last edit: 8/10/2009 5:10:25 AM)
show user profile  s_purs
alot of new gpus are really powerful units, which rarely get used to their full potential. with new technology and windows 7 the system can use the gpu as another processor for your system (i believe) and maybe it is a way of doing this too?

or you could render using your gpu for one thing and then still have your cpus free to do other studd/render other things? as your gpu isnt used during standard rendering
read 2188 times
8/10/2009 5:23:13 AM (last edit: 8/10/2009 5:23:13 AM)
show user profile  Octopuzzy
rendering on the gpu is many times faster. something that takes say a minute on the cpu, is realtime @ 40 frames/sec on the gpu so u could move around in your 'rendered' scene. Heres a link to a demo video;
http://www.cgarchitect.com/news/SIGGRAPH-2009-CHAOS-GROUP-GPU.shtml




read 2182 times
8/10/2009 5:36:48 AM (last edit: 8/10/2009 5:36:48 AM)
show user profile  Jock
I see, thanks for the replies.
read 2178 times
8/10/2009 5:40:35 AM (last edit: 8/10/2009 5:40:35 AM)
show user profile  s_purs
damn that was a cool video
read 2174 times
8/10/2009 5:48:30 AM (last edit: 8/10/2009 5:48:30 AM)
show user profile  advance-software
"with new technology and windows 7 the system can use the gpu as another processor for your system"


Win7 changes zero with respect to GPU capability.

DirectX 11 will be available on Vista and 7.

OpenGL and OpenCL are available all the way back to 2000 (and possibly earlier), also Linux, Mac, etc.

GPUs are already other processors in your system - "graphics processing unit".

They cannot run traditional x86 programs (except perhaps Larabee), but are highly parallel and very powerful, leading to the emergence of real-time raytracing / advanced lighting, etc.

Lots of fun stuff coming through ...

Is this is the same stuff Bolts & Error were on about recently ?
read 2168 times
8/10/2009 6:08:13 AM (last edit: 8/10/2009 6:09:25 AM)
show user profile  s_purs
'They cannot run traditional x86 programs (except perhaps Larabee), but are highly parallel and very powerful, leading to the emergence of real-time raytracing / advanced lighting, etc.'

from what i got told at work is that the latest systems, with a 9 series or above nvidia card, and windows 7 can literally use the gpu as a cpu
read 2163 times
8/10/2009 6:14:09 AM (last edit: 8/10/2009 6:14:09 AM)
show user profile  advance-software
They're not quite the same things, but I can see where the confusion comes in. Most GPUs cannot run native x86 code ("Windoze programs"). x86 emulation will probably turn up at some point, leading to removal of the dependancy on the legacy architecture.

This is not Win7 specific, which is a good thing.

Hopefully the V-ray RT (GPU edition) will be made available as a library to third party developers.

Can't wait to write an Infinity driver for this - it doesn't make sense for every software vendor to write their own raytracer. Might as well license the best one from the pros.

------------------------------------

GPUs can run programs. Just not traditional Windows API ones, which require an x86 compatible processor.

Instead, they run highly parallel funky stuff like the demo posted above.

As they are becoming increasingly powerful, it's only a matter of time before Windows OS emulation is implemented on "GPU"s by MS and/or others, enabling us to discard the legacy architecture and move forward with the new architecture. We're in a middle of the road position at the moment, with the new architecture becoming increasingly powerful and beginning to dominate.

All good. :-)

V
read 2158 times
8/10/2009 6:24:03 AM (last edit: 8/10/2009 7:07:32 AM)
show user profile  s_purs
hmm.. i got told completely the opposite. they said that the new architecture of cards, win 7 and new technology in systems generally, will allow exactly that- to run programs. will have a read up on it and see if i can find some facts


edit:

Nvidia Tesla product manager Sumit Gupta said their GPUs speed up Windows 7 and Apple's "Snow Leopard" because they're cool like that.

Last week we reported that Nvidia released its OpenCL driver and software development kit (SDK) for those enrolled in the OpenCL Early Access Program. The company released the driver early to receive feedback before distributing the beta. Nvidia said that the new driver would run on the CUDA architecture, enabling it to take advantage of the GPU's parallel computing. However, Sumit Gupta, product manager for Nvidia's Tesla products, went into more detail in an interview Friday, explaining how the Nvidia GPUs will accelerate software in Windows 7 and Apple's OS X Snow Leopard operating systems.

"The really interesting thing about OpenCL and DirectX is that OpenCL is going to form part of the Apple operating system (Snow Leopard) and DirectX (version 11) will form part of Windows 7," Gupta told CNET. "And what that essentially means to consumers is, if your laptop has an Nvidia GPU or ATI (AMD) GPU, it will run the operating system faster because the operating system will essentially see two processors in the system. For the first time, the operating system is going to see the GPU both as a graphics chip and as a compute engine," he said. Additionally, consumers using Windows 7 will see the GPU as a CPU in Task Manager.

But aren't GPUs meant for rendering graphics? Primarily, yes, however they've taken on a new responsibility within recent years as technology has improved, enabling them to help tackle more general computing processes usually handled by the system's main processor. Consider the GPU as a "helper" now, offering up its higher-end processing areas to compute a portion of a task carried out by the CPU, allowing both to work "in concert" rather than separate entities. This parallel processing will actually speed up both operating systems, however the benefit isn't a holy grail provided by Nvidia alone: ATI GPUs also provide a general purpose environment as well.

According to AMD, its ATI Stream technology is defined as a set of advanced hardware and software technologies that enable AMD graphics processors to work along with the system's CPU, working in parallel, to accelerate many applications beyond just graphics; Nvidia's CUDA works in the same manner. In addition, Nvidia's CUDA is compatible with many computational interfaces including PhysX, Java, Python, OpenCL, and DirectX Compute; ATI's Stream is compatible with DirectX, Havok's physics middleware, and OpenCL.

So the question is this: if GPUs are taking on the role of general processing (in addition to graphics processing), are CPU's on their way out? No. "If you're running an unpredictable task, the CPU is the jack of all trades," Gupta said. "It is really good at these unpredictable tasks. The GPU is a master of one task. And that is a highly parallel task."

http://www.tomshardware.com/news/Windows-Leopard-Cuda-Stream,7648.html

(if thats something different and im confused, then sorry)

read 2146 times
8/10/2009 6:35:29 AM (last edit: 8/10/2009 6:39:50 AM)
show user profile  advance-software
> are CPU's on their way out? No.

Yes, but it'll take a while.


What they're saying is that Win7 will be able to offload some tasks to the GPU to accellerate them in much the same way as you can already do with video encode/decode. The GPU doesn't run the OS.

Yet.

As we move forwards, what we think of today as a GPU will probably be rebranded as a CPU, because it is becoming a general purpose processor. The point is x86 is on the way out. About time.

"If you're running an unpredictable task, the CPU is the jack of all trades," Gupta said. "It is really good at these unpredictable tasks. The GPU is a master of one task. And that is a highly parallel task."

Which is true, but as we move forwards, parallel processor architectures ('GPUs') will be extended to include better scheduling / out of order execution / larger caches / multiple threads / etc. enabling them to in effect become a superset of existing CPUs. Once they are sufficiently powerful, why do you want a legacy processor taking up space on your motherboard ? (answer - to run legacy apps, for now)

In summary : new tech is coming through so we'll be able to make some very cool next gen apps and you guys won't have to wait so long for your renders.

(which is nice)
read 2135 times
8/10/2009 6:45:25 AM (last edit: 8/10/2009 7:24:04 AM)
show user profile  toldaddy
*yawn* that toss between the two of you was hella boring.

That video is freakin' amazing - makes me feel like I've been wasting my time with MR. Kudos to chaos group for actually pushing the envelope to stay competitive instead of milking their software for every cent it's worth *caugh* autodesk *caugh*



read 2059 times
8/10/2009 8:33:29 PM (last edit: 8/10/2009 11:17:26 PM)
show user profile  9krausec
after watching that video I am completely blown back. This could revolutionize the CGI industry. I mean that gpu kicked the cpu's ass! Think of where this is leading? I mean if that was a mediocre graphics card that they where using... Wow!




- Portfolio-




read 2048 times
8/10/2009 9:03:20 PM (last edit: 8/10/2009 9:03:20 PM)
show user profile  mattymoose
i have no opinion about the technical implications but that was a pretty cool tech demo


read 2044 times
8/10/2009 9:05:33 PM (last edit: 8/10/2009 9:05:33 PM)
show user profile  Error404
.. makes me feel like I've been wasting my time with MR

you've seen the light ;-)

www.DanielBuck.net - www.DNSFail.com

read 2035 times
8/10/2009 10:32:38 PM (last edit: 8/10/2009 10:32:38 PM)
show user profile  toldaddy
amen matty.

ahh the implications this has for games though... =P I can't stop geeking out about it.

Yeah.... Definitely going to demo vray again.. oooo vray for maya. nice.



read 2025 times
8/10/2009 11:16:49 PM (last edit: 8/10/2009 11:16:49 PM)
 
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