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Complex Mesh Modeling (Warbird Head)
show user profile  Ygg
im going through some training meshes, i found this exellent warbird mesh from Mike Dilliott on trekmeshes, im a bit baffled at how you arrive at such perfect squares in such a complicated shape

i can work out the details but what is the technique to start with, is it lofted, boxmodeled, meshsmooth? so basically the typical Hwygamt (How would you go about making this)?
read 735 times
2/9/2015 4:31:20 AM (last edit: 2/9/2015 4:42:54 AM)
show user profile  Ygg
read 728 times
2/9/2015 4:39:48 AM (last edit: 2/9/2015 4:42:13 AM)
show user profile  luxxeon
I only see one view there, from the Left camera angle? Anyway, from that viewpoint, the shape doesn't look all that complex to me. It's definitely turbosmoothed, which is what gives it the resolution, but if you want a better look at topology, then convert to edit poly and "quadrify all". This will remove all the mid-edges, and give you a cleaner view of the topology as quads.

That said, it appears to be a nice model, and you can probably get it just surface modeling a few primitives to start.

My Youtube Video Tutorials:
read 727 times
2/9/2015 4:42:33 AM (last edit: 2/9/2015 4:42:33 AM)
show user profile  Ygg
yeah but these squares are perfect to the screen, i dont really need to quadrify (although a cool tip that), you see the squares already, i doubt even turbosmooth can deliver that
read 726 times
2/9/2015 4:46:18 AM (last edit: 2/9/2015 4:46:18 AM)
show user profile  luxxeon
Ok, I see it from the front now. It's hard to tell what the topology looks like. You need to quadrify all to get a better idea. The topology looks a bit messy to me, with a lot of smoothing artifacts too.

My Youtube Video Tutorials:
read 725 times
2/9/2015 4:48:24 AM (last edit: 2/9/2015 4:48:24 AM)
show user profile  luxxeon
You get that kind of result from auto retopology. He may have just sculpted the object, then used automatic retopo to create the mesh, then either TS or meshsmooth. Wrapit creates a result like that.

My Youtube Video Tutorials:
read 723 times
2/9/2015 4:50:44 AM (last edit: 2/9/2015 4:50:44 AM)
show user profile  Ygg
yep, good eye there, discouragingly even a mesh this good seems to be troubled, there are a lot of artifacts and errors, the warbird is such a tricky shape, it baffles me how they managed to do it initially
read 719 times
2/9/2015 5:11:23 AM (last edit: 2/9/2015 5:11:23 AM)
show user profile  Ygg
ahh wrapit, well possible, cant judge it since i dont have it, mesh smooth and turbo smooth dont strike me as real retopology tools but more topology enhancers, this one looks more like retopo indeed, how could you model it while keeping these perfect squares all over
read 717 times
2/9/2015 5:15:38 AM (last edit: 2/9/2015 5:15:38 AM)
show user profile  luxxeon
Those perfect squares, as you say, definitely indicate some sort of automatic topology. The reason I say to quadrify all, is because if you look closely, you'll see triangles in areas where they shouldn't be... at corners and curved edges. Removing the visible interior edges would reveal this. This is bad topology, and no one modeling this by hand would want to do that on purpose. That kind of thing is sure to cause pinching and artifacting.

It's a cool shape, but it could be had using edge extrusion modeling with sub-d. The topology wouldn't have all perfect little squares and tris like that, but would have a more logical topology, and smoother surface.

My Youtube Video Tutorials:
read 715 times
2/9/2015 5:30:42 AM (last edit: 2/9/2015 5:31:58 AM)
show user profile  Ygg
yeah and less artifacts, close up this mesh is not quite viable, ill give edge extruding and sub-d a try, but its a tough shape, its that vicious organic-technical mix, ive found a few warbird meshes but all improvised and flawed, thanks for the input :)
read 710 times
2/9/2015 6:03:56 AM (last edit: 2/9/2015 6:03:56 AM)
show user profile  herfst1
That mesh is faaaar from good. Sure, not that bad, but you're giving it undue praise.
read 686 times
2/9/2015 11:32:56 AM (last edit: 2/9/2015 11:32:56 AM)
show user profile  Octopuzzy
It's a horrible mesh..I don't know why this would be something you'd strive for.
If you really want to have that square topology, you can do it to any model in Houdini with the divide sop.

read 680 times
2/9/2015 12:18:11 PM (last edit: 2/9/2015 12:18:11 PM)
show user profile  LionDebt
That mesh is broken. It is not a "good" mesh.

You need to learn about 'proper' edge-flow.

How models will deform when animated.

Proper articulation of joints / muscle groups.

This is 'good' topology of a face - unwrapped. Notice how the edges loop around the eyes, nose and mouth. This allows for those vertices to move without distorting the overall shape of the face.

Similarly for the body, legs, arms... Certain edges around the knees, hips, shoulders etc are placed closer to allow for a greater range of movement.

Never heard of 'training-meshes' or 'trekmeshes'. But what I've shown you here is more along the lines of 'excellent meshes'...

Check out for more examples and greater theory.

read 673 times
2/9/2015 12:51:24 PM (last edit: 2/9/2015 12:51:24 PM)
show user profile  IBENEZ21
I looks like it was modelled in MOI or Rhino, and converted to fbx within one of those programs.

read 649 times
2/9/2015 5:59:23 PM (last edit: 2/9/2015 5:59:23 PM)
show user profile  luxxeon
"I looks like it was modelled in MOI or Rhino, and converted to fbx within one of those programs."

Yep. Or Modo's MeshFushion. Meshfushion will convert to complex, small quads like this too, but with no attention to edge flow around corners, or curves. It tends to put tris at pointed corner edges (quads cut off at midpoint, just like in these screencaps) of a hard surface model. Either way, it was definitely an algorithmic quadrification of a mesh, not hand modeled.


My Youtube Video Tutorials:
read 639 times
2/10/2015 12:01:16 AM (last edit: 2/10/2015 12:02:45 AM)
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